Am I crazy? Or just stupid?

[WrenchMonkey]

I want/need a new tow rig. The dogs won't fit in the Ford at all, and they're really getting too big for the XJ. Plus, I'd like a big SUV to camp in.

So I've been shopping big-block Suburbans. The 96-99 7.4 Vortec, and the 01-02 8.1. Both are cheap, but harder to find than you might think.

Found this one in Columbus: http://columbus.craigslist.org/cto/3693990511.html

Price is right, and a rebuilt 7.4. But the rest of it's got right at 200k miles.


Am I crazy (or dumb!) to think about towing with a 200k rig?

Robert

[itbrokeagain]

My truck has 315,000. Tranny was rebuilt at 250,000

[comanchedude]

It's all about maintanince , if worn parts are replaced its fine. I would find out what "engine overhaul means" if it was a total rebuild with every thing machined to spec then good, if it was just a tear down and reassemble then ..not so good.
But it looks nice. If the tranny has never been replaced expect that to go soon.thats a grand.. But no your not crazy. And Burbans are solid tow rigs from what I read.

[93 Krawler]

I want/need a new tow rig. The dogs won't fit in the Ford at all, and they're really getting too big for the XJ. Plus, I'd like a big SUV to camp in.

So I've been shopping big-block Suburbans. The 96-99 7.4 Vortec, and the 01-02 8.1. Both are cheap, but harder to find than you might think.

Found this one in Columbus: http://columbus.craigslist.org/cto/3693990511.html

Price is right, and a rebuilt 7.4. But the rest of it's got right at 200k miles.


Am I crazy (or dumb!) to think about towing with a 200k rig?

Robert

Personally, for a little more, I would get 2002 or newer and get the LS based 6.0 or 8.1. They have more power and torque than the old style engines, and they should last longer. The 2002 8.1 has 340/455 and the 6.0 has 320/365.

[twiztedzuki]

Personally, for a little more, I would get 2002 or newer and get the LS based 6.0 or 8.1. They have more power and torque than the old style engines, and they should last longer. The 2002 8.1 has 340/455 and the 6.0 has 320/365.

if i was tow with gas, which i wouldnt, id would atleast go ls series also

[WrenchMonkey]

Personally, for a little more, I would get 2002 or newer and get the LS based 6.0 or 8.1. They have more power and torque than the old style engines, and they should last longer. The 2002 8.1 has 340/455 and the 6.0 has 320/365.

There's an 02 in LaGrange with 140k:
http://www.championcbg.com/VehicleDetails/used-2002-Chevrolet-Suburban-2500-La_Grange-KY/1939513133

I'd LOVE the extra power of the 496, but it's all loaded up, dvd and all, and asking $9200. I'm having a hard time justifying almost twice as much cash, for a camping and dog rig...

The six liters are easier to find, and would probably be plenty. I just got it in my head that I wanted a bigblock...

I dunno, decisions decisions...

Thanks guys!
:beers:

[Drivermod]

I tow with a 2000 Chevy Express van with the 7.4 liter. Pulls pretty good and gets 10 mpg with a loaded open trailer (14 on the highway without the trailer). My Expedition only got 9 mpg towing. I was surprised how well it tows. I don't think you necessarily need the LS engine.

[underpowered]

the 8.1 is not LS based, it is still based on the good ol' BBC.

what about a powerstroke excursion? keep the diesel and get the SUV all in one?

i ended up with a powerstroke after looking for basically what you are. i wanted a 7.4 or 8.1 GM truck and had a very difficult time finding one that was not ragged out or over priced. but i did find more Suburbans than i did trucks when i was looking.

but to the actual question, if it was well maintained, i would have no issues with a 200k tow rig. my silverado i just got rid of had 220k on it, and every bit of the drive train was original on it. i would not hesitate on a well cared for high mileage rig.

[blazerbrad]

How much weight do you tow, and how often? My 1-ton K5 on the car hauler weighs close to 9k and I use a 6.0L 2500HD. There are times when more power would be nice but it gets the job done and I've always been able to at least maintain the speed limit on the freeway if you really want to (i.e. let it downshift). Granted, haven't been in any big mountains but been down to Slade many times and out I-70 in Eastern Ohio many times (not unusual to have 18-wheelers doing 40 mph in spots).

132k so far with the majority of the miles daily driving on the freeway. The engine did lose the oil pump and was run for a short period with no oil pressure 30k ago but no apparent issues so far. The only other thing ever replaced was the water pump at the same time the oil pump was replaced. Guess I did change the plugs at 100k per the service manual.

[humpy]

I have an 01 2500 Chevrolet with 6.0.. Bout it 4 1/2 years ago with 196k on it and it now has 262k I have put one set of brakes and just replaced steering parts last month.. It's been a damn good truck I would pull my camper to Florida today and not be scared... Pulls our 28' 5th wheel all the time and hauls the rig just fine.. 8-9 mile a gallon.. I had the old style motors and I will say I love the 6.0 ls.. Diesel is obivuously best but if goin gas pony up and somethin with 6.0

[67fastback]

my 04 6.0l 2500 gas has 131k now and still running stong but I have pulled 30 foot trailer with 2 sami on it.. and also have 18 steel deck with 2 sami on it..pull both nice been to Harlin a bunch of times with no issues.. I have had the water pump go out under warrenty and changed out front wheel bearings.. other wise a good truck... :thumbup:
bad is the trans is only 4 speed and kicks into over drive at 4500 on some hills...


would be great if it had allison!!!

[94Dodge Truggy]

You CRAZY! Turn the truck bed into dog quarters.

[WrenchMonkey]

what about a powerstroke excursion? keep the diesel and get the SUV all in one?

I looked for about a minute and a half. Decent ones are pushing 18-20 grand. There's no WAY I'm spending that on a tow rig / puppy transport, especially if a gas Burban will do it for 5-8...

How much weight do you tow, and how often?

3500# XJ on a 1500# trailer. Once a month or so to BigRock. I am looking at Harlan next month, but that's unusual for me. At any rate, not nearly enough miles to worry too much about the mileage...

You CRAZY! Turn the truck bed into dog quarters.

Crossed my mind too. But they're pretty neurotic, they get all agitated if they're boxed in without us. 320# of velcro-dogs. Plus, we gotta be able to roll the windows down!


You guys do have me reconsidering a GMT800. I'm already scheduled to look at this '99 tomorrow, but if I don't love it, I'll look again at 01-ups.

Thanks again!
Robert

<Edit> The 01+ will also give me four-wheel-discs, vs rear drums on the 99, right?

[WrenchMonkey]

Drove it, liked it.
Didn't love it, didn't buy it.

The search continues, thinkin 8.1...

Robert

[mckeddie]

There's no comparison between pulling with a big block suburban and a 10 excursion. The excursion is soooooooooooo much better in everything it does. I've had 2 excursion v10's a 6.0l Denali, and a 99 suburban. Excursions win hands down ieverything except driving like a car.

I was going through the same thing as you when I bought my current one. I got a good deal when I bought it. Now I need a truck again, and have been thinking hard about selling it (drove a crew cab 7.3 dually superduty today i really liked). I honestly would have rather towed with my 05 hemi Durango than the suburban. The Denali just had too many toys to not enjoy driving I always.

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u266/mckeddie/IMAG0422_zps5b138d46.jpg

[WrenchMonkey]

Good looking rig!

There's no comparison between pulling with a big block suburban and a 10 excursion...

Here was my thought process on that.

The 6.8 Ex's are rated at 310hp and 425ft-lbs, and book around $11-12f.
The 7.4 Vortec Burbs produce 290hp and 410lbs, for about $5-6k.
The newer 8.1s, 340hp and 455lbs, for $8-9k.

So compared to a V10 Excursion, I figured I could get an older Burb that had 95% of the power and 98% of the torque, for about half the price.

Or, a newer one, with 10% MORE power and torque, still for less than 75 cents on the dollar.



Now I know that money isn't everything, sometimes you do get what you pay for. And that not everything that works on paper also works on the road.

But, that was how I decided on a Burban over an Excursion.


And this input is exactly what I asked for, to challenge those numbers.

So thanks!
:beers:

[mckeddie]

Excursions can be had cheap, you just have to look around. Just be sure to try and find one that has had the exhaust manifolds done, and had the spark plugs professionally done. Check the bottom of the doors on the inside for rust too, that's the first thing to go.

[humpy]

I'm not a fan of the ford v10... Drove a motorhome with one in it with an f450 chassis... Goin up o my dad pulled off and left the v10 sittin in his 1986 big block chevy class a... V10 was a class c... I know I favor gm products but Its pretty bad when a heavier vehicle with 14 year older technology than what the v10 is walked off and left it and got 4 mpg better!...the dodge v10 seems to run better than the ford... Just my opinion

[T-bird]

I have a 2002 F-350 V-10 that i bought new and its been fine. The V-10 was only a $600 option when I bought the truck so I went with it. I would do it again for only $600 but no more. I get 12 mpg on the highway but I drive fast ~80 and have gotten as bad as 6.8 mpg when towing 10,000 lbs.

I don't think you are towing enough to really worry about needing a diesel or any larger motor than any 1 ton truck has as their base option. Big Rock is a really easy tow and if your only hitting Harlan once a year, thats not reason enough to spend so much extra cash.

[WrenchMonkey]

I don't think you are towing enough to really worry about needing a diesel or any larger motor than any 1 ton truck has as their base option. Big Rock is a really easy tow and if your only hitting Harlan once a year, thats not reason enough to spend so much extra cash.

That was my thought. I never mentioned that I'm using a 7.3 Powerstroke now, and while it's great and really can't feel the jeep at all, it's just way more than I need...

[93 Krawler]

I thought about a diesel too, but for the 6 times a year I tow my rig, the cost didn't seem worth it. That's why I opted for a 6.0 1 ton express box truck. I can tow and sleep in it. I'll find out how good it tows my junk next week to Harlan.
6555

You could always get a 1 ton express van so you and your doggies would have plenty of room. Unless you're looking for a daily driver with more than 2 seats...

[itbrokeagain]

One day I will have a school bus tow rig. flat bed outback and a camper up front

[T-bird]

That was my thought. I never mentioned that I'm using a 7.3 Powerstroke now, and while it's great and really can't feel the jeep at all, it's just way more than I need...

In that case you are defiantly going to need a diesel. You can never take a step down in power, only up.

[mckeddie]

Went from a v10 to the gm's to a 7.3 then back to the v10. I'm searching hot and heavy for a 7.3 again, but only bc I need a pickup, and I can't imagine having a truck without a diesel.

[mckeddie]

Here's a pretty sweet looking 96 bib block burb for $5000

Warning, this site is addictive, and you will start cycling through cars quickly if you are anything like me.

http://www.mautofied.com/1996-Chevrolet-Suburban_Lifted-Trucks/listing/100569776/

[WrenchMonkey]

http://www.championcbg.com/VehicleDetails/used-2002-Chevrolet-Suburban-2500-La_Grange-KY/1939513133

Buying now...

[fastford]

Nice :thumbup:, should pass everything except a gas station lol

[itbrokeagain]

I think you should turbo it or 1 of those big ass superchargers that comes through the hood

[93 Krawler]

Looks nice. That ought to pull just about anything.

[mckeddie]

$8000 and you can have my excursion, nice fresh top end on motor, clean interior, 125,000 miles...

[comanchedude]

http://www.championcbg.com/VehicleDetails/used-2002-Chevrolet-Suburban-2500-La_Grange-KY/1939513133

Buying now...

Nice!

[94Dodge Truggy]

That will be nice to sleep in as well! Nice truck!

[itbrokeagain]

How does it drive?

[WrenchMonkey]

Drives like a Buick. Tows like a CHAMP. I have zero doubt that it would keep up with my powerstroke. 75 up hills without a downshift.

It's 1500# lighter than my Furd, so the trailer pushes just a little more, but not bad at all...

And it is thirsty. I need to run a full tank for solid numbers, but it looks like about 6-8mpg...

Of course, that was towing. At 75. Uphill...

[fordman00]

Dang and I was unhappy with 14-16 towing.

Sent from my DROID RAZR

[WrenchMonkey]

I was hoping for ten, but I knew that was optimistic. I'll take eight...

My diesel only turned 13, and can cost me up to a buck a gallon extra. So this isn't that bad...

[fastford]

So it all equals out, plus your dogs have room and no more sleeping in a tent

[WrenchMonkey]

So it all equals out, plus your dogs have room and no more sleeping in a tent

...and no more $110 oil changes...

[fordman00]

I change mine every 5000. Which is like once a year maybe twice. Lol. My next one I'm gonna send off to have tested and maybe go a little longer.

Sent from my DROID RAZR

[fastford]

...and no more $110 oil changes...

Damn, just did one in a 6.0 powerstroke for 60.00 with a motorcraft filter.

[WrenchMonkey]

Mine was four gallons of oil, about $20 each. Add a filter the size of a two liter bottle and tax, $110...

[fastford]

Mine was four gallons of oil, about $20 each. Add a filter the size of a two liter bottle and tax, $110...

I got rotella for 10.99 a gallon at O'Reilly

[fordman00]

Yeah. It adds up with a ford 16 qts in a 7.3 both my dodges are 12 QTS. Not bad about 70 with filter.

Sent from my DROID RAZR

[itbrokeagain]

I thought the 8 quarts in my Toyota was bad....

[fordman00]

8 QTS in a yota! what???!!

Sent from my DROID RAZR

[fastford]

8 QTS in a yota! what???!!

Sent from my DROID RAZR

That's what my tundra holds

[itbrokeagain]

8 QTS in a yota! what???!!

Sent from my DROID RAZR

yup. But it's good for 10,000 miles

[fordman00]

Dang.

Sent from my DROID RAZR

[WrenchMonkey]

8 quarts in my Toyota... but it's good for 10,000 miles

So it leaks a quart every 1200 miles? Sounds like a Jeep!
:D

[itbrokeagain]

So it leaks a quart every 1200 miles? Sounds like a Jeep!
:D

And if you saw my driveway you would agree

[WrenchMonkey]

So the right rear window rolls down fine, and halfway back up.

Then it slows, then crawls, then stops about 2" from closed. If you hold the button and push the glass, it'll close all the way.

Anybody wanna guess whether it's just a weak motor that no longer has the strength to lift the glass? Or the whole regulator assembly that's binding up?

The motor is $35 in stock. The regulator is $110 special order...

[KargoMaster]

I believe the third rule of shade tree mechanics is that it will be the more expensive part... but you'll probably buy the motor first anyway...:D

[biggin69]

My old body style Chevy did the same thing. It was the assembly. I found out after I did the motor first. :eek:

[94Dodge Truggy]

Slap some vaseline around the outer window channels to help the window travel easier. Or throw a rock through the window and then it will be open all the way. :thumbup:

[comanchedude]

pull panel and look at it in action. its most likely the motor is shot. you may be able to remove motor and then lift and lower by hand if its smooth and not binding just replace motor, if its rough or binds,sticks and is hard to operate ya need the assembly ..

and here is the whole deal from amazon $54.00 shipped
OEM #15135971, Partslink #GM1551114

http://www.amazon.com/POWER-WINDOW-REGULATOR-PASSENGER-REPLACEMENT/dp/B009GIPCMI/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1364993301&sr=8-14&keywords=2002+suburban+rear+window+motor

[Hope Springs Hauler]

So what did you buy? Link is dead.

If the regulator is like the 1 Tom pictured, they go out frequently. I have done the drivers door 2x in 7 years from frayed cables. Thankfully, O'reillys had lifetime warranty on the assembly.

[WrenchMonkey]

I believe the third rule of shade tree mechanics is that it will be the more expensive part... but you'll probably buy the motor first anyway...:D

That sounds about right... :D

...the whole deal from amazon $54.00 shipped...

Auto parts from Amazon. Who'da thunk it.

Thanks!

[comanchedude]

Auto parts from Amazon. Who'da thunk it.

Thanks!

Amazon sells everything.. we like..