new to the club

03-02-2009, 09:16 PM

i have a 97 & 80 model jeep. both have 4in lift. 97 has a 4 cyl. and 33 no power. what gears would u prefor or would u change motor? only has 70,000 mileson it. the 80 so far i have redone the frame. it has 2 piece rear axles junk they keep breaking does anybody have a fix 4 it? it has a 304,33tires thanks 4 any feed back.

Trigger · 03-02-2009, 09:26 PM

If you've got the money and time, go with a motor swap in the 97. The 4.0L is a great motor, with plenty of power for 33s. If you can't afford a motor swap, 4.10 or 4.88 gears will help get it moving, but you're going to lose a lot of top end.

As for the 80, there are 1 piece axles available for it. The kits run less than $300. Should be a simple swap, although I have never done it. Ultimately, you should look for a stronger axle then the AMC 20 you've got in it. You can't polish a turd too much.

03-02-2009, 09:34 PM

thanks the 97 does have 4 10 gears already. a buddy told me no matter what motor if u dont have the right gear it will not help. dont no 4 sure.what rear end would u use 4 the cj

maddhatter · 03-02-2009, 10:16 PM

Welcome.

I still say a Dana 20 with 1 peace axles is every bit as strong as a stock Dana 44. I have been running a set for years with a locker and my Jeep was a rental Jeep in Moab, UT for years before I got it. Spend the $250 and get the one peace axles.

03-02-2009, 10:21 PM

thanks bud

JeffK5 · 03-02-2009, 10:28 PM

The Model 20 should handle a 304/33" tires just fine with a little work, How wild do you get when you wheel<

The factory 2 piece axles are absolute ****.... after that the housing is the next weal link. If you have a good straight housing with intact plug welds then I wouldn't be afraid to but a 1 piece kit in it and go.

The R&P of a 20 is stronger than a D44 , seen lots of busted pinion gears on rear Dana 44's.

I broke both M20 and D44 rears and ended up with a 9" that lasted...

maddhatter · 03-02-2009, 10:30 PM

Sorry not "Dana 20" its a "AMC 20" I always do that!:(

JET455 · 03-02-2009, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pipedope

i have a 97 & 80 model jeep. both have 4in lift. 97 has a 4 cyl. and 33 no power. what gears would u prefor or would u change motor? only has 70,000 mileson it. the 80 so far i have redone the frame. it has 2 piece rear axles junk they keep breaking does anybody have a fix 4 it? it has a 304,33tires thanks 4 any feed back.

on the TJ put at least 4.88's or 5.13's if you are go up to 35" tires. keep the motor with that many miles engine swaps can be expensive cause you will need to change the trans and t-case or t-case in put. harness and computer.

I have a whole 4.0 motor/trans swap/t-case/harness/computer available low miles If you have the $$$ to play with

I also have some good M20 one piece axle sets for your axle if intersted? Moser and Superior

Trigger · 03-03-2009, 08:45 AM

Oh, I almost forgot. If you're going to continue to run the AMC 20 in the rear, have someone truss it for you. Those have been known to "Smiley Face" when wheeled hard.

03-03-2009, 09:24 PM

i do my own fab work. family welding shop--fab shop. if u goto woodsbuggy.com type in pipedope you will see my own design of my rail buggy.its also on drews off road web site home page.i have a 1 year old boy so i bought the cj to cruise in some mud with him.i climb in my buggy.i have around 20,000 in my buggy. also how much do u want for the 1 piece axles?

JET455 · 03-03-2009, 10:05 PM

sent you a pm

blazerbrad · 03-04-2009, 02:02 PM

The four cylinders with stock gears and 33's are a complete dog. Granted the 4.0L six is much stronger but I've seen a lot of people pretty happy with the four banger with the proper gears. I *think* 4.88 is as low as you can go with the D35 rear/D30 front axles but not 100% sure. I know at least a couple people in our club that went to 4.88's with 33-34" tires and they said it was a huge improvement on the road. You shouldn't lose any top end at all going to 4.88's with the 4 banger with the larger tires, mainly because you will actually be able to use 5th gear again (the guy with 34" LTB's couldn't even pull 5th gear with stock axle gears unless going downhill). Though before spending the $$ on gears for the rear axle I would at least consider the options of upgrading, pending on what you do with the Jeep.

I agree that adding 1 piece axles to a AMC 20 makes them decent strength-wise, IF you do something about the housing bending. Another guy in our club got maybe a couple of years of easy to moderate trails out of the rear axle in his CJ-7 (stock 258 and 33" tires) before it got the smiley face look.

JeepHD · 03-04-2009, 05:29 PM

Pulling a buddies Rear Model 20 tonight. Fully rebuilt a few years back and not many miles since. Axle has 3.55 gears, 1 piece axles, and a lockrite locker. He is looking to sell if interested.
Also will have the 30 front fully rebuilt at the same time, also has a lockrite. He will also have some nice aluminum mickey thompson rims 15x10 with 33 boggers to go with the axles. Great setup, he just ran into some awesome deals on bigger stuff.

Everything is in excellent condition(he is very particular about his stuff). PM me if interested and I will get you his info

acousticrawk · 03-04-2009, 06:14 PM

did you built that hting yourself? i have a 74 bug i want to put some long travel suspension on and make into a class 5 type baja. any suggestions? how big is the engine on your buggy? (found a blue one on woods i think is yours?)

mckeddie · 03-04-2009, 07:59 PM

4.88 is as low a gear you can get for the lp30, i would do that ,and toss the rear in teh trash and get an 8.8 with discs for it with matching gears (8.8's can be had fairly cheap, and arent that hard to swap in if you can weld). i would do the rear axle swap at the same time you regear, or find a stock 44 to swap back there. as of the cj, i would put 1 piece axles in it for sure. and just so you know, a stock 304 isn't putting out a whole lot more hp than that little 4 cyl is.

03-04-2009, 09:03 PM

Thanks alot guys. acousticrawk im running a well built 2276 all scat parts.and yes i did build the rail my self been bugging for 16 years.but ive always had a jeep never been with out 1. blue 1 is mine its all powder coated if anybody needs powdercoat done my buddy does it all. i live in lucasville. not to far from cinci.

03-04-2009, 09:07 PM

Mckiddie the cj has a new built 258 not a 4 cly.the 304 dont have alot of miles either.so ur saying the 304 isnt going to give me anymore hp? how about torge? i like the sound that the v8 makes.

mckeddie · 03-05-2009, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pipedope

Mckiddie the cj has a new built 258 not a 4 cly.the 304 dont have alot of miles either.so ur saying the 304 isnt going to give me anymore hp? how about torge? i like the sound that the v8 makes.

i meant the TJ's 4 cyl isn't much less hp than the CJ's 304's horsepower. a 304 only makes like 135 horse in stock form, don't remember the torque figure, but it's not alot more. they do sound damned good though with a set of headers and flowmasters.

acousticrawk · 03-05-2009, 12:58 AM

how much to have 4 wheels powdercoated?

KargoMaster · 03-05-2009, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mckeddie

i meant the TJ's 4 cyl isn't much less hp than the CJ's 304's horsepower. a 304 only makes like 135 horse in stock form, don't remember the torque figure, but it's not alot more. they do sound damned good though with a set of headers and flowmasters.

Ok, now I feel as though I need to defend my former powerplant's honor... torque is where it's at for that engine...

72-78
AMC 304 V8
Bore x Stroke 3.75" x 3.44"
Displacement 304(4.98L)
Compression Ratio 8.4:1
Horsepower (net) 150@4200
Torque (net) 245@2500
Main Bearings 5
Valve Configuration OHV
Fuel 2bbl

Then more and more emissions crap was added:

80-81
AMC 304 V8
Bore x Stroke 3.75" x 3.44"
Displacement 304(4.98L)
Compression Ratio 8.4:1
Horsepower (net) 125@3200
Torque (net) 220@2400
Main Bearings 5
Valve Configuration OHV
Fuel 2bbl

maddhatter · 03-05-2009, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pipedope

Mckiddie the cj has a new built 258 not a 4 cly.the 304 dont have alot of miles either.so ur saying the 304 isnt going to give me anymore hp? how about torge? i like the sound that the v8 makes.

Nope, No big gain at all going from a 4.2 to a 304. The 304 also has a crappy oil pump set up. Can you tell I'm not a big fan of the 304?
If you want to make some HP do a 360 swap. It bolts up the same and is a better motor then a 304 "I think". All three are great power plants.

carwash · 03-05-2009, 05:11 PM

my biggest complaint about the 304 is the front mounted distributer... it is the suck when it comes to water issues.

i never had a problem with the power from my 304... always worked just fine for me... and i abused it like it belonged to someone else. I wont know what to do with all this big block torque in the new rig.

03-02-2009, 09:16 PM	#1
pipedope Guest Posts: n/a	new to the club i have a 97 & 80 model jeep. both have 4in lift. 97 has a 4 cyl. and 33 no power. what gears would u prefor or would u change motor? only has 70,000 mileson it. the 80 so far i have redone the frame. it has 2 piece rear axles junk they keep breaking does anybody have a fix 4 it? it has a 304,33tires thanks 4 any feed back.

03-03-2009, 10:05 PM	#11
JET455 Your wifes pimp! Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Everywhere!!!!!! Posts: 548	sent you a pm __________________ if i am not currently offending you, i will be shortly.

03-04-2009, 05:29 PM	#13
JeepHD www.buckeyejeepers.com Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Houston, OH 45333 Posts: 276	Pulling a buddies Rear Model 20 tonight. Fully rebuilt a few years back and not many miles since. Axle has 3.55 gears, 1 piece axles, and a lockrite locker. He is looking to sell if interested. Also will have the 30 front fully rebuilt at the same time, also has a lockrite. He will also have some nice aluminum mickey thompson rims 15x10 with 33 boggers to go with the axles. Great setup, he just ran into some awesome deals on bigger stuff. Everything is in excellent condition(he is very particular about his stuff). PM me if interested and I will get you his info __________________ 1994 YJ, 4.0, 5 speed. *2006 Dodge 2500 Cummins, 4x4 Auto,Quad cab, LongBed, Tekonsha Prodigy(Tow Rig)

03-04-2009, 06:14 PM	#14
acousticrawk The MacDaddy Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Price Hill, (Cincinnati) Posts: 63	did you built that hting yourself? i have a 74 bug i want to put some long travel suspension on and make into a class 5 type baja. any suggestions? how big is the engine on your buggy? (found a blue one on woods i think is yours?) __________________ http://springfieldohiojeepers.freeforums.org/index.php

03-04-2009, 07:59 PM	#15
mckeddie Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: van wert oh Posts: 583	4.88 is as low a gear you can get for the lp30, i would do that ,and toss the rear in teh trash and get an 8.8 with discs for it with matching gears (8.8's can be had fairly cheap, and arent that hard to swap in if you can weld). i would do the rear axle swap at the same time you regear, or find a stock 44 to swap back there. as of the cj, i would put 1 piece axles in it for sure. and just so you know, a stock 304 isn't putting out a whole lot more hp than that little 4 cyl is. __________________ zuk buggy.....it'll be a jeep eventually.

03-02-2009, 09:26 PM	#2
Trigger Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Xenia, OH Posts: 281	If you've got the money and time, go with a motor swap in the 97. The 4.0L is a great motor, with plenty of power for 33s. If you can't afford a motor swap, 4.10 or 4.88 gears will help get it moving, but you're going to lose a lot of top end. As for the 80, there are 1 piece axles available for it. The kits run less than $300. Should be a simple swap, although I have never done it. Ultimately, you should look for a stronger axle then the AMC 20 you've got in it. You can't polish a turd too much.

03-02-2009, 09:34 PM	#3
pipedope Guest Posts: n/a	thanks the 97 does have 4 10 gears already. a buddy told me no matter what motor if u dont have the right gear it will not help. dont no 4 sure.what rear end would u use 4 the cj

03-02-2009, 10:16 PM	#4
maddhatter Join Date: May 2007 Location: loveland OH Posts: 324	Welcome. I still say a Dana 20 with 1 peace axles is every bit as strong as a stock Dana 44. I have been running a set for years with a locker and my Jeep was a rental Jeep in Moab, UT for years before I got it. Spend the $250 and get the one peace axles.

03-02-2009, 10:28 PM	#6
JeffK5 Tiny Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Colerain Posts: 798	The Model 20 should handle a 304/33" tires just fine with a little work, How wild do you get when you wheel< The factory 2 piece axles are absolute ****.... after that the housing is the next weal link. If you have a good straight housing with intact plug welds then I wouldn't be afraid to but a 1 piece kit in it and go. The R&P of a 20 is stronger than a D44 , seen lots of busted pinion gears on rear Dana 44's. I broke both M20 and D44 rears and ended up with a 9" that lasted...

03-02-2009, 10:30 PM	#7
maddhatter Join Date: May 2007 Location: loveland OH Posts: 324	Sorry not "Dana 20" its a "AMC 20" I always do that!:(

03-03-2009, 08:45 AM	#9
Trigger Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Xenia, OH Posts: 281	Oh, I almost forgot. If you're going to continue to run the AMC 20 in the rear, have someone truss it for you. Those have been known to "Smiley Face" when wheeled hard.

03-03-2009, 09:24 PM	#10
pipedope Guest Posts: n/a	i do my own fab work. family welding shop--fab shop. if u goto woodsbuggy.com type in pipedope you will see my own design of my rail buggy.its also on drews off road web site home page.i have a 1 year old boy so i bought the cj to cruise in some mud with him.i climb in my buggy.i have around 20,000 in my buggy. also how much do u want for the 1 piece axles?

03-04-2009, 02:02 PM	#12
blazerbrad - CORE Member - Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 831 Images: 6	The four cylinders with stock gears and 33's are a complete dog. Granted the 4.0L six is much stronger but I've seen a lot of people pretty happy with the four banger with the proper gears. I think 4.88 is as low as you can go with the D35 rear/D30 front axles but not 100% sure. I know at least a couple people in our club that went to 4.88's with 33-34" tires and they said it was a huge improvement on the road. You shouldn't lose any top end at all going to 4.88's with the 4 banger with the larger tires, mainly because you will actually be able to use 5th gear again (the guy with 34" LTB's couldn't even pull 5th gear with stock axle gears unless going downhill). Though before spending the $$ on gears for the rear axle I would at least consider the options of upgrading, pending on what you do with the Jeep. I agree that adding 1 piece axles to a AMC 20 makes them decent strength-wise, IF you do something about the housing bending. Another guy in our club got maybe a couple of years of easy to moderate trails out of the rear axle in his CJ-7 (stock 258 and 33" tires) before it got the smiley face look.

03-04-2009, 09:03 PM	#16
pipedope Guest Posts: n/a	Thanks alot guys. acousticrawk im running a well built 2276 all scat parts.and yes i did build the rail my self been bugging for 16 years.but ive always had a jeep never been with out 1. blue 1 is mine its all powder coated if anybody needs powdercoat done my buddy does it all. i live in lucasville. not to far from cinci.

03-04-2009, 09:07 PM	#17
pipedope Guest Posts: n/a	Mckiddie the cj has a new built 258 not a 4 cly.the 304 dont have alot of miles either.so ur saying the 304 isnt going to give me anymore hp? how about torge? i like the sound that the v8 makes.

03-05-2009, 12:58 AM	#19
acousticrawk The MacDaddy Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Price Hill, (Cincinnati) Posts: 63	how much to have 4 wheels powdercoated? __________________ http://springfieldohiojeepers.freeforums.org/index.php

03-05-2009, 05:11 PM	#22
carwash pimpin' IS easy Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Union, KY Posts: 3,344 Images: 605	my biggest complaint about the 304 is the front mounted distributer... it is the suck when it comes to water issues. i never had a problem with the power from my 304... always worked just fine for me... and i abused it like it belonged to someone else. I wont know what to do with all this big block torque in the new rig. __________________