My on-board welder project(The Hillbuilt)

Coppertop · 10-11-2009, 01:13 AM

Since I started wheeling theres always been a desire to carry everything a person needs to get off the trail. Including a on-board welder ,after checking the price of a store bought one .Well lets just say I had to come up with a cheaper option..
The Hillbuilt was born.

A 130 amp alternator I picked up at U-pull &Pay for 25.00 bucks..

The custom made bracket.

The install ,removed the a/c compressor and bolted the custom made bracket to the mount.

The first weld with a set of jumper cables as the leads.. Heck it was a test couldn't believe it turned out that well.. I had one hand on the welding lead and the other on the throttle speeding up the engine for amps.

So the Hillbuilt is borned ( Trademark and patent pending)

A video to follow ..

Comments,Concerns,and input welcome.

Nick

WrenchMonkey · 10-11-2009, 01:32 AM

Sweet!

I know there's a way to bump up the idle, but I'll be damned if I can think how at the moment...

And I guess you have to signal the new alt when you want it to charge, right? So it doesn't run all the time?

Details, son! Details!

(Otherwise, how the hell are the rest of us supposed to infringe on your patents?!?)

Robert

Coppertop · 10-11-2009, 01:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrenchMonkey

Sweet!

I know there's a way to bump up the idle, but I'll be damned if I can think how at the moment...

And I guess you have to signal the new alt when you want it to charge, right? So it doesn't run all the time?

Details, son! Details!

(Otherwise, how the hell are the rest of us supposed to infringe on your patents?!?)

Robert

Yes all good questions my friend..

The throttle. I'm thinkin' bike lever shifter & cable assy.

The wiring is still work in progress. Yes it will not run all the time.. Input welcome..

Nick

WrenchMonkey · 10-11-2009, 03:05 AM

Did a little searchin...

Apparently, the later (post-renix) Police-issue XJ's had an "Extended Idle" switch that'd bump the idle about a grand.

Kicker is, the PCMs are all the same, so the circuitry is there. Find the right lead, ground it through a switch on the dash, and bingo.

http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=35197

Post #21 is where it starts getting good...

Robert

Coppertop · 10-11-2009, 03:24 AM

Nice work Bud

Hmm... very interesting.

Reconsidering the bike cable...

Nick

Coppertop · 10-11-2009, 10:32 AM

More info worth mentioning...

The alternator...
As mentioned purchased from You Pull & Pay for 25.00 bucks.
Removed from a 1998 Ford Expedition 4.6 engine.
It's a Auto Zone Reman Duralast Part# DL350-16 130 amp.

The wiring...
To get the alt to charge and/or weld I did the following.
The orange wire on the A terminal of the regulator was supplied with constant 12 volts.
The green wire on the I terminal of the regulator was supplied with 12 volts when I was ready to weld.
The output terminal for the welding lead and /or battery charging connection.
The ground lead was clamped to the alt body and to the metal being welded.

I'm thinking about making a elect box.. Guess I could buy one I have seen several different ones on other welding setups.

My goal to keep it simple and on the cheap. Out of pocket so far 35.00 Bucks

Nick

RuffedUpXJ · 10-11-2009, 03:16 PM

So did you just run a switch or a relay to supply the 12V to the alt. ? Also I plan on running my AC with a second alternator with a second V-belt pulley and stuffing the alt. in somewhere. Also, I like the idea of a clutch on the second alt. to reduce the load but might just make it easy to adjust for the belt and just put the belt on when I want to weld. So have you made anything to adjust the throttle position to adjust the power?

Coppertop · 10-11-2009, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RuffedUpXJ

So did you just run a switch or a relay to supply the 12V to the alt. ? So have you made anything to adjust the throttle position to adjust the power?

I'm still deciding on the final switch and wiring set-up... I ran out of time to work on it this weekend .. It will be a few weeks before I'm back on the project.

I like Robert's (Wrenchmonkey) post about wiring in a high idle switch.

Nick

kb9qdi · 10-11-2009, 10:13 PM

Sweet.....I like it

jfiscus · 10-12-2009, 09:31 AM

Another idea would be to take a look at the cruise control setups on XJs & replace that cable with another "bike cable" type of setup that you could position at a certain RPM when welding was required.

Coppertop · 10-12-2009, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kb9qdi

Sweet.....I like it

Thanks. I'm amazed how it welds.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfiscus

Another idea would be to take a look at the cruise control setups on XJs & replace that cable with another "bike cable" type of setup that you could position at a certain RPM when welding was required.

Yep, the bike cable is a great idea and I was going this route till Robert found the High Switch set-up. Good point on the bike cable allowing you to set it at certain RPMS.

Decisions,Decisions...

Nick

WrenchMonkey · 10-12-2009, 01:24 PM

Well, if you're going to wire a switch to engage the second alternator, you could get a double-acting switch that'd do both at once: trigger the alt and the high-idle.

In fact, I could get you a big manly one you could mount right under the hood, next to the alt, so you hook up the cables, flip the "on/off" switch, and go.

Robert

RuffedUpXJ · 10-12-2009, 02:49 PM

Did you just go to UPullandPay and asked what cars had a higher amp alternator? Also, I am planing the bike cable ish idea for the adjustablity.

I am putting in a control box under the hood with the switch there since I will have to hook the cables up and adjust the idle.

Coppertop · 10-13-2009, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrenchMonkey

In fact, I could get you a big manly one you could mount right under the hood, next to the alt, so you hook up the cables, flip the "on/off" switch, and go.

Robert

Hmm. Like your thinking..If not to much trouble,maybe a pic of the switch.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RuffedUpXJ

Did you just go to UPullandPay and asked what cars had a higher amp alternator? Also, I am planing the bike cable ish idea for the adjustablity.

I am putting in a control box under the hood with the switch there since I will have to hook the cables up and adjust the idle.

Sorta, I went down there and checked all the fords.. Sometimes I've seen newer alts on them. Once I found the donor. I called a friend at O-Reilys he looked up the alt for that vehicle. If it's a full size with all the elect accessories, it should be a high amp alt.

Yep, My control box will be similar to yours.

Nick

RuffedUpXJ · 10-13-2009, 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coppertop

Sorta, I went down there and checked all the fords.. Sometimes I've seen newer alts on them. Once I found the donor. I called a friend at O-Reilys he looked up the alt for that vehicle. If it's a full size with all the elect accessories, it should be a high amp alt.

Yep, My control box will be similar to yours.

Nick

I picked up part of my control box today from Radio Shack. I am planing on using the quick disconnect welding ends and like 20' of leads. So one thing I am thinking I will wait on is the panel gauge. I have all the wire between the Alt and control box but need leads and disco's and the stringer/clamp. So hopefully a call to a good friend will net me all of those. I guess working at a steel erection company in the summers might pay off.

I am got some work ahead of me since I am keeping my AC comp since it houses my OBA. So I haven't figured out if the battert is moving or the air box is out of the picture.

WrenchMonkey · 10-14-2009, 01:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coppertop

Hmm. Like your thinking..If not to much trouble,maybe a pic of the switch.

Something like this:

That's the idea anyway...

Ours don't have the fancy little arrow, just a white stripe...

See ya

jfiscus · 10-14-2009, 09:52 AM

remove the air box Nate, keep a list of what parts you buy from where, I'd like to do this asap also. Do a cowl snorkle intake, that's what I'm doing next, that'll free up all your air box room.

RuffedUpXJ · 10-14-2009, 12:39 PM

Yeah thats what I saw and thinking I will be doing. i am adding a pully to the PS pulley so I can run the alt of of that with a V-belt

jfiscus · 10-14-2009, 02:29 PM

With adding an extra pully it would be a good time to convert to dual electric fans to relieve some of the stress on the system by removing the fan clutch. I've seen a few in person now that run dual electric OEM fans with no issues.
get ahold of me sometime & we'll do these projects. My garage is wide open now that I got the old CJ out so plenty of room for whatever ideas we come up with.

RuffedUpXJ · 10-14-2009, 03:35 PM

Yeah i planned to take that thing off since I have never had a shroud for it anyways. Right now we are still unwedding-ing and trying to get the house back to normal. Doesn't help my contract job ends in at the end of the year and the old lady was laid off 2 weeks before the wedding. Anyways enough of that.

Anymore test with this Weldernator?

Coppertop · 10-14-2009, 06:17 PM

Thanks for the pic Robert.. I hope to get some time next week to check on the elect box. May try and stop at Radio Shack tonight.

Nick

RuffedUpXJ · 10-14-2009, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coppertop

Thanks for the pic Robert.. I hope to get some time next week to check on the elect box. May try and stop at Radio Shack tonight.

Nick

I hit up Radio Shack for a "Project Box", two switches, two fuse holders, and a LED yesterday and also got a 110V plug from the depot.

This is how my control box is looking right now:

Coppertop · 10-15-2009, 06:17 PM

Nice job RuffedUpXj... What your cost in your elect box?

Nick

RuffedUpXJ · 10-15-2009, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coppertop

Nice job RuffedUpXj... What your cost in your elect box?

Nick

It's like $18 right now and then when I add the welding disconnects it will almost double. But its nice and contained so no water or Haspin dirt inside.

Now its alt. and welding leads with stinger and ground. So the big bucks are left. I plan to head to UPullandPay and look at some Fords with accessories and hopefully a Cronw Vic since they are 130 amp with the Police Option that could have 180 amp.

maddhatter · 10-15-2009, 11:45 PM

Very cool set up. Nice work.

What welding rods should be used?

10-11-2009, 01:13 AM	#1
Coppertop XJWHEELING Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Colerain Township Posts: 837	My on-board welder project(The Hillbuilt) Since I started wheeling theres always been a desire to carry everything a person needs to get off the trail. Including a on-board welder ,after checking the price of a store bought one .Well lets just say I had to come up with a cheaper option.. The Hillbuilt was born. A 130 amp alternator I picked up at U-pull &Pay for 25.00 bucks.. The custom made bracket. The install ,removed the a/c compressor and bolted the custom made bracket to the mount. The first weld with a set of jumper cables as the leads.. Heck it was a test couldn't believe it turned out that well.. I had one hand on the welding lead and the other on the throttle speeding up the engine for amps. So the Hillbuilt is borned ( Trademark and patent pending) A video to follow .. Comments,Concerns,and input welcome. Nick __________________ Just a 200 dollar cherokee that wouldn't start .. Ten years later same chrome grille .. Last edited by Coppertop; 10-11-2009 at 01:20 AM.

10-11-2009, 03:05 AM	#4
WrenchMonkey Mechanical Animal - CORE Member - - Moderator - Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Beechmont Posts: 1,883	Did a little searchin... Apparently, the later (post-renix) Police-issue XJ's had an "Extended Idle" switch that'd bump the idle about a grand. Kicker is, the PCMs are all the same, so the circuitry is there. Find the right lead, ground it through a switch on the dash, and bingo. http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=35197 Post #21 is where it starts getting good... Robert __________________ DIRTY DEEDS, DONE DIRT CHEAP Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stranger

10-11-2009, 03:24 AM	#5
Coppertop XJWHEELING Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Colerain Township Posts: 837	Nice work Bud Hmm... very interesting. Reconsidering the bike cable... Nick __________________ Just a 200 dollar cherokee that wouldn't start .. Ten years later same chrome grille ..

10-11-2009, 10:32 AM	#6
Coppertop XJWHEELING Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Colerain Township Posts: 837	More info worth mentioning... The alternator... As mentioned purchased from You Pull & Pay for 25.00 bucks. Removed from a 1998 Ford Expedition 4.6 engine. It's a Auto Zone Reman Duralast Part# DL350-16 130 amp. The wiring... To get the alt to charge and/or weld I did the following. The orange wire on the A terminal of the regulator was supplied with constant 12 volts. The green wire on the I terminal of the regulator was supplied with 12 volts when I was ready to weld. The output terminal for the welding lead and /or battery charging connection. The ground lead was clamped to the alt body and to the metal being welded. I'm thinking about making a elect box.. Guess I could buy one I have seen several different ones on other welding setups. My goal to keep it simple and on the cheap. Out of pocket so far 35.00 Bucks Nick __________________ Just a 200 dollar cherokee that wouldn't start .. Ten years later same chrome grille ..

10-11-2009, 03:16 PM	#7
RuffedUpXJ On XJ 2 Now Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Fairfield Twp. Posts: 314	So did you just run a switch or a relay to supply the 12V to the alt. ? Also I plan on running my AC with a second alternator with a second V-belt pulley and stuffing the alt. in somewhere. Also, I like the idea of a clutch on the second alt. to reduce the load but might just make it easy to adjust for the belt and just put the belt on when I want to weld. So have you made anything to adjust the throttle position to adjust the power? __________________ 88 XJ - 5" lift - 35" BFG's - Bumpers - Rock Rails - Homebrewed OBA - Roof Rack - Tube Doors - Trimmed - Dented 87 XJ - D44 - Disco D30 - 235's - 231TC - Stock for now

10-11-2009, 01:32 AM	#2
WrenchMonkey Mechanical Animal - CORE Member - - Moderator - Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Beechmont Posts: 1,883	Sweet! I know there's a way to bump up the idle, but I'll be damned if I can think how at the moment... And I guess you have to signal the new alt when you want it to charge, right? So it doesn't run all the time? Details, son! Details! (Otherwise, how the hell are the rest of us supposed to infringe on your patents?!?) Robert __________________ DIRTY DEEDS, DONE DIRT CHEAP Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stranger

10-11-2009, 10:13 PM	#9
kb9qdi Storm Chaser Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Harrison,Ohio Posts: 142	Sweet.....I like it __________________ 06 TJ, 8.8 Aussied, 4.88's and 35" KM2's

10-12-2009, 09:31 AM	#10
jfiscus Terrain Stomper Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Crittenden, KY Posts: 633	Another idea would be to take a look at the cruise control setups on XJs & replace that cable with another "bike cable" type of setup that you could position at a certain RPM when welding was required.

10-12-2009, 01:24 PM	#12
WrenchMonkey Mechanical Animal - CORE Member - - Moderator - Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Beechmont Posts: 1,883	Well, if you're going to wire a switch to engage the second alternator, you could get a double-acting switch that'd do both at once: trigger the alt and the high-idle. In fact, I could get you a big manly one you could mount right under the hood, next to the alt, so you hook up the cables, flip the "on/off" switch, and go. Robert __________________ DIRTY DEEDS, DONE DIRT CHEAP Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stranger

10-12-2009, 02:49 PM	#13
RuffedUpXJ On XJ 2 Now Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Fairfield Twp. Posts: 314	Did you just go to UPullandPay and asked what cars had a higher amp alternator? Also, I am planing the bike cable ish idea for the adjustablity. I am putting in a control box under the hood with the switch there since I will have to hook the cables up and adjust the idle. __________________ 88 XJ - 5" lift - 35" BFG's - Bumpers - Rock Rails - Homebrewed OBA - Roof Rack - Tube Doors - Trimmed - Dented 87 XJ - D44 - Disco D30 - 235's - 231TC - Stock for now

10-14-2009, 09:52 AM	#17
jfiscus Terrain Stomper Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Crittenden, KY Posts: 633	remove the air box Nate, keep a list of what parts you buy from where, I'd like to do this asap also. Do a cowl snorkle intake, that's what I'm doing next, that'll free up all your air box room.

10-14-2009, 12:39 PM	#18
RuffedUpXJ On XJ 2 Now Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Fairfield Twp. Posts: 314	Yeah thats what I saw and thinking I will be doing. i am adding a pully to the PS pulley so I can run the alt of of that with a V-belt __________________ 88 XJ - 5" lift - 35" BFG's - Bumpers - Rock Rails - Homebrewed OBA - Roof Rack - Tube Doors - Trimmed - Dented 87 XJ - D44 - Disco D30 - 235's - 231TC - Stock for now

10-14-2009, 02:29 PM	#19
jfiscus Terrain Stomper Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Crittenden, KY Posts: 633	With adding an extra pully it would be a good time to convert to dual electric fans to relieve some of the stress on the system by removing the fan clutch. I've seen a few in person now that run dual electric OEM fans with no issues. get ahold of me sometime & we'll do these projects. My garage is wide open now that I got the old CJ out so plenty of room for whatever ideas we come up with.

10-14-2009, 03:35 PM	#20
RuffedUpXJ On XJ 2 Now Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Fairfield Twp. Posts: 314	Yeah i planned to take that thing off since I have never had a shroud for it anyways. Right now we are still unwedding-ing and trying to get the house back to normal. Doesn't help my contract job ends in at the end of the year and the old lady was laid off 2 weeks before the wedding. Anyways enough of that. Anymore test with this Weldernator? __________________ 88 XJ - 5" lift - 35" BFG's - Bumpers - Rock Rails - Homebrewed OBA - Roof Rack - Tube Doors - Trimmed - Dented 87 XJ - D44 - Disco D30 - 235's - 231TC - Stock for now

10-14-2009, 06:17 PM	#21
Coppertop XJWHEELING Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Colerain Township Posts: 837	Thanks for the pic Robert.. I hope to get some time next week to check on the elect box. May try and stop at Radio Shack tonight. Nick __________________ Just a 200 dollar cherokee that wouldn't start .. Ten years later same chrome grille ..

10-15-2009, 06:17 PM	#23
Coppertop XJWHEELING Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Colerain Township Posts: 837	Nice job RuffedUpXj... What your cost in your elect box? Nick __________________ Just a 200 dollar cherokee that wouldn't start .. Ten years later same chrome grille ..

10-15-2009, 11:45 PM	#25
maddhatter Join Date: May 2007 Location: loveland OH Posts: 324	Very cool set up. Nice work. What welding rods should be used? __________________