Hamilton & New Tech to Stop Speeding

tjjeepjeep · 04-01-2010, 09:30 AM

From wcpo.com: Guess it's better than Fairfield which is supposedly giving tickets for breathing wrong...

HAMILTON, Ohio -- One local police department is about to launch some new technology that could make you change your driving habits.

Hamilton police say they are the first in the area to get a vehicle that can enforce speed without an officer inside.

The new radar car looks like a typical SUV, but on top there's a radar. Inside there's a computer.

There are two cameras in the front and two in the back that capture video and still pictures of speeding cars.

"One will be focused on the license plate, the other will take continuous data," said Officer Rick Miller.

Miller says he never thought he'd live to see something like this.

The data automatically goes to an Arizona company called Redflex Traffic Systems that tracks the license plate of the speeding car and sends a $95 ticket to the person the car is registered to.

Hamilton police will review every citation before it's sent. An officer will not be in the vehicle as it gathers information.

"The cost of the program to the city is zero, so if it doesn't generate any revenue, that's fine," says Hamilton Police Sergeant Craig Bucheit. “If it slows people down and makes people safer, that's what's important to us.”

The car is owned by the traffic company.

The city gets 52% of all the money collected.

Hamilton Police say you have to be going at least nine miles over the speed limit to get caught by the cameras.

The police chief says the radar car will be used in school zones and around parks.

"We have complaints in a lot of those areas," says Chief Neil Ferdelman.

"We hope that we can keep a better check on crime because in this economy, this is a way for us to work smarter," the Chief says.

James and Starlene Crawford are a brother and sister who live in a home that sits within the school zone for Hamilton's Fairwood Elementary and Garfield Middle School.

They think the idea's great.

"I see them flying up and down here all day, every day," says James.

"I've seen several children almost get hit – including mine – that go to these schools," says Starlene.

If you get one of the tickets, it's not reported to the Bureau of Motor Vehicles or your insurance company.

You have a month to get used to the radar car. Only warnings will be given for the first 30 days.

http://www.wcpo.com/news/local/story...W4NK7fQcQ.cspx

94Dodge Truggy · 04-01-2010, 10:15 AM

Most government has become a business to make money and control in their interest. Whats the odds that this machine will venture out of the local parks and school zones and onto rt.4 or other locations? Wondering what are the statistics on previous injuries in the area they plan on keeping safer compared to their targeted goals on the new safety the machine will hopefully provide.

Last week a friend of mine was ticketed by the hamilton police dept. for having excessively high headlights. Tape measure was used to determine that his lights were over the 48" height law measuring the center of the headlamp. Seen some semi's and trains that better watch out!

tjjeepjeep · 04-01-2010, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 94Dodge Truggy

Last week a friend of mine was ticketed by the hamilton police dept. for having excessively high headlights. Tape measure was used to determine that his lights were over the 48" height law measuring the center of the headlamp.

Surprised at the 48"...thought 54"
(B) Height — Every headlamp upon every vehicle, including every motorcycle and motor-driven cycle, shall be located at a height measured from the center of the headlamp of not more than fifty-four inches nor less than twenty-four inches to be measured as set forth in section 4513.03 of the Revised Code.
http://codes.ohio.gov/oac/4501-15

But I'm not an expert and didn't look at this for long honestly..

94Dodge Truggy · 04-01-2010, 10:44 AM

48 it is according to hamiltons law. Wonder if it is worth paying a lawyer and a persons time to fight against the city?

94Dodge Truggy · 04-01-2010, 10:49 AM

The zero cost to the city is nice! So the out of state company will place the machine in their desired location. Hamilton will not be able to drive it to the location, establish locations or review violations as they will have zero money in it. Sure.

tjjeepjeep · 04-01-2010, 10:55 AM

Thankfully I drive an x90...so speeding isn't really an issue for me...

Hope Springs Hauler · 04-01-2010, 11:06 AM

i wonder what happens when 5 gallons of paint is poured over the car?

Truggy, you got a paintball gun?

If police are not writing the ticket, what makes it a legal citation?

94Dodge Truggy · 04-01-2010, 11:48 AM

Its all about $ as it has become a business. Red light cameras have only increased the amount of wrecks as the money rolls in. This has been proven in Middletown as well. I do not speed in parks or in school zones as it gives me no pleasure in doing so.

94Dodge Truggy · 04-01-2010, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hope Springs Hauler

i wonder what happens when 5 gallons of paint is poured over the car?

Truggy, you got a paintball gun?

If police are not writing the ticket, what makes it a legal citation?

Shockwave proof is what I was wondering. Got 2 paintball guns but was in trouble years ago for a similar instance.

94Dodge Truggy · 04-01-2010, 11:53 AM

Hamilton police and other businesses for their own common good and not who they are supposed to serve should be licensed as any other business has to be and read like this "Hamilton Police Dept. LLC."

I need to think some happy thoughts for a bit! Rant off.

WrenchMonkey · 04-01-2010, 12:34 PM

Shoulda stayed in Mt Washington...

Robert

biggin69 · 04-01-2010, 09:20 PM

It is nothing more than a revenue generator, 100%! I do not care what the City says. This all came about last year when when the City realized that it was going to be 400 bazillion dollars (yes that is a lot!) in debt in a couple of years if they did not do something soon.

Maybe they should look at ways to bring business back to the city instead of running everyone off....

I better stop now as I am employed by the City and do not want to say something I should not.......Keep paying your utility bills!

jfiscus · 04-02-2010, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 94Dodge Truggy

Its all about $ as it has become a business. Red light cameras have only increased the amount of wrecks as the money rolls in. This has been proven in Middletown as well. I do not speed in parks or in school zones as it gives me no pleasure in doing so.

I live in Middletown so I have experience with these POS's from redflex. The company makes money hand over fist all day long & every city they try to market them to nowadays is buying into it with the current economical conditions. The red light cameras are placed in the lower income neighborhoods, yes, in my area. There are none out in the more expensive areas of town where people run red lights just the same. the tickets from these things are split between the company and the city, and the city can say they have "no investment" in them so noone has to approve their installation since they "aren't costing the city anything". the tickets DO NOT cost as points against your license, but you still have to pay them or the city can enforce it (on your property taxes/utilities possibly?). the city has to be clearly marked that it used therse types of cameras at all entrances to the city so that visitors are aware of their use and the intersections also have signs at them "rewarning" you of their use. (who pays for all these signs???) After a couple years of the cameras here, a few stopped generating as much revenue so the city had a new "study" done and relocated and added more cameras to boost their income...

Now, a mobile vehicle sounds like a whole new can of worms. Don't think for one minute that the city will just use it in school zones during school hours. this is all about the cheese, and there's no cheese better than government cheese.

tjjeepjeep · 04-02-2010, 10:43 AM

I saw on redflex's site that they were in Middletown, wondered experience.. Was curious when I noted no points and no impact to insurance. Guess it makes sense they'll enforce against something tho to get their money.

WrenchMonkey · 04-02-2010, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jfiscus

There are none out in the more expensive areas of town where people run red lights just the same...

I commute from Withamsville, through Anderson, Mt Washington, Mt Lookout, Hyde Park, and Madisonville, on my way to Norwood.

I can tell you first hand that the more (ahem) apartment complexes there are in a neighborhood, the more people tend to blow redlights.

That said, I think (A) automated enforcement, purely for the sheer revenue stream, is an absolute crock, and (B) Obviously targeting the intersections in some neighborhoods (with less political influence?) and ignoring others is just as big a pile of horse poo as only setting up DUI checkpoints in the better neighborhoods where they know they can soak the average driver for $2500 in fees...

Robert

8UP · 04-02-2010, 07:18 PM

The enforcement part has become a big issue in a lot of Cities. Dayton has had red light cameras for years, West Carollton has red light cameras and automated speed limit ticketing also. The "Tickets" these things spit out are a civil action, not a law enforcement action, which is why such a large number of people aren't paying them. I keep hearing second hand that the Police won't go after someone with this type of ticket, I'd really like to hear the REAL info on it.

Nuts · 04-02-2010, 11:51 PM

In Middletown they send you a few pictures of you running the light along with a ticket for 100 bucks. You can fight it BUT you have to send the money in then wait for a court date and if you're found not guilty they'll give you the 100 back,probably minus court costs....

If you choose not to pay the first ticket they'll send you another for $125 and you lose the right to fight it in court.

If you don't pay that one they'll send a third ticket for $150 with a bunch of mumbo jumbo about how its you're final warning.

When you don't pay the third apparently they give up and start bothering somebody else

Acording to them I've "ran through" 3 red lights in the last 3-5 years. I paid the first ticket after they sent me the final warning, then didn't pay the second two and nothing has ever happened. I've been stopped for speeding once or twice and have renewed my drivers lincense since then also and nothing came up on my record.

That last part makes me sound like a terrible driver running 3 lights and getting stopped twice lol. But the camera takes your picture if any part of your truck crosses over a certain line after the light turns red. So its not like I was just blowing through intersections 10 seconds after the light changed lol

04-01-2010, 09:30 AM	#1
tjjeepjeep Just tired Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hamilton, OH Posts: 2,213 Images: 2212	Hamilton & New Tech to Stop Speeding From wcpo.com: Guess it's better than Fairfield which is supposedly giving tickets for breathing wrong... HAMILTON, Ohio -- One local police department is about to launch some new technology that could make you change your driving habits. Hamilton police say they are the first in the area to get a vehicle that can enforce speed without an officer inside. The new radar car looks like a typical SUV, but on top there's a radar. Inside there's a computer. There are two cameras in the front and two in the back that capture video and still pictures of speeding cars. "One will be focused on the license plate, the other will take continuous data," said Officer Rick Miller. Miller says he never thought he'd live to see something like this. The data automatically goes to an Arizona company called Redflex Traffic Systems that tracks the license plate of the speeding car and sends a $95 ticket to the person the car is registered to. Hamilton police will review every citation before it's sent. An officer will not be in the vehicle as it gathers information. "The cost of the program to the city is zero, so if it doesn't generate any revenue, that's fine," says Hamilton Police Sergeant Craig Bucheit. “If it slows people down and makes people safer, that's what's important to us.” The car is owned by the traffic company. The city gets 52% of all the money collected. Hamilton Police say you have to be going at least nine miles over the speed limit to get caught by the cameras. The police chief says the radar car will be used in school zones and around parks. "We have complaints in a lot of those areas," says Chief Neil Ferdelman. "We hope that we can keep a better check on crime because in this economy, this is a way for us to work smarter," the Chief says. James and Starlene Crawford are a brother and sister who live in a home that sits within the school zone for Hamilton's Fairwood Elementary and Garfield Middle School. They think the idea's great. "I see them flying up and down here all day, every day," says James. "I've seen several children almost get hit – including mine – that go to these schools," says Starlene. If you get one of the tickets, it's not reported to the Bureau of Motor Vehicles or your insurance company. You have a month to get used to the radar car. Only warnings will be given for the first 30 days. http://www.wcpo.com/news/local/story...W4NK7fQcQ.cspx __________________ I want to be the reason you look down at your phone and smile........then walk into a pole.

04-01-2010, 10:15 AM	#2
94Dodge Truggy EX-Vice President Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Fairfield, Ohio Posts: 3,048	Most government has become a business to make money and control in their interest. Whats the odds that this machine will venture out of the local parks and school zones and onto rt.4 or other locations? Wondering what are the statistics on previous injuries in the area they plan on keeping safer compared to their targeted goals on the new safety the machine will hopefully provide. Last week a friend of mine was ticketed by the hamilton police dept. for having excessively high headlights. Tape measure was used to determine that his lights were over the 48" height law measuring the center of the headlamp. Seen some semi's and trains that better watch out! __________________

04-01-2010, 10:44 AM	#4
94Dodge Truggy EX-Vice President Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Fairfield, Ohio Posts: 3,048	48 it is according to hamiltons law. Wonder if it is worth paying a lawyer and a persons time to fight against the city? __________________

04-01-2010, 10:49 AM	#5
94Dodge Truggy EX-Vice President Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Fairfield, Ohio Posts: 3,048	The zero cost to the city is nice! So the out of state company will place the machine in their desired location. Hamilton will not be able to drive it to the location, establish locations or review violations as they will have zero money in it. Sure. __________________

04-01-2010, 10:55 AM	#6
tjjeepjeep Just tired Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hamilton, OH Posts: 2,213 Images: 2212	Thankfully I drive an x90...so speeding isn't really an issue for me... __________________ I want to be the reason you look down at your phone and smile........then walk into a pole.

04-01-2010, 11:06 AM	#7
Hope Springs Hauler Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Hamilton, OH Posts: 431 Images: 16	i wonder what happens when 5 gallons of paint is poured over the car? Truggy, you got a paintball gun? If police are not writing the ticket, what makes it a legal citation? __________________ 1988 Suzuki Samurai on propane FJ 40 axles (4.10) 5.14 tcase 36" TSL SX

04-01-2010, 11:48 AM	#8
94Dodge Truggy EX-Vice President Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Fairfield, Ohio Posts: 3,048	Its all about $ as it has become a business. Red light cameras have only increased the amount of wrecks as the money rolls in. This has been proven in Middletown as well. I do not speed in parks or in school zones as it gives me no pleasure in doing so. __________________

04-01-2010, 11:53 AM	#10
94Dodge Truggy EX-Vice President Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Fairfield, Ohio Posts: 3,048	Hamilton police and other businesses for their own common good and not who they are supposed to serve should be licensed as any other business has to be and read like this "Hamilton Police Dept. LLC." I need to think some happy thoughts for a bit! Rant off. __________________

04-01-2010, 12:34 PM	#11
WrenchMonkey Mechanical Animal - CORE Member - - Moderator - Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Beechmont Posts: 1,883	Shoulda stayed in Mt Washington... Robert __________________ DIRTY DEEDS, DONE DIRT CHEAP Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stranger

04-01-2010, 09:20 PM	#12
biggin69 Really??? Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Cincy Posts: 678	It is nothing more than a revenue generator, 100%! I do not care what the City says. This all came about last year when when the City realized that it was going to be 400 bazillion dollars (yes that is a lot!) in debt in a couple of years if they did not do something soon. Maybe they should look at ways to bring business back to the city instead of running everyone off.... I better stop now as I am employed by the City and do not want to say something I should not.......Keep paying your utility bills!

04-02-2010, 10:43 AM	#14
tjjeepjeep Just tired Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hamilton, OH Posts: 2,213 Images: 2212	I saw on redflex's site that they were in Middletown, wondered experience.. Was curious when I noted no points and no impact to insurance. Guess it makes sense they'll enforce against something tho to get their money. __________________ I want to be the reason you look down at your phone and smile........then walk into a pole.

04-02-2010, 07:18 PM	#16
8UP Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 1 Posts: 92	The enforcement part has become a big issue in a lot of Cities. Dayton has had red light cameras for years, West Carollton has red light cameras and automated speed limit ticketing also. The "Tickets" these things spit out are a civil action, not a law enforcement action, which is why such a large number of people aren't paying them. I keep hearing second hand that the Police won't go after someone with this type of ticket, I'd really like to hear the REAL info on it.

04-02-2010, 11:51 PM	#17
Nuts Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: middletown,oh Posts: 508	In Middletown they send you a few pictures of you running the light along with a ticket for 100 bucks. You can fight it BUT you have to send the money in then wait for a court date and if you're found not guilty they'll give you the 100 back,probably minus court costs.... If you choose not to pay the first ticket they'll send you another for $125 and you lose the right to fight it in court. If you don't pay that one they'll send a third ticket for $150 with a bunch of mumbo jumbo about how its you're final warning. When you don't pay the third apparently they give up and start bothering somebody else Acording to them I've "ran through" 3 red lights in the last 3-5 years. I paid the first ticket after they sent me the final warning, then didn't pay the second two and nothing has ever happened. I've been stopped for speeding once or twice and have renewed my drivers lincense since then also and nothing came up on my record. That last part makes me sound like a terrible driver running 3 lights and getting stopped twice lol. But the camera takes your picture if any part of your truck crosses over a certain line after the light turns red. So its not like I was just blowing through intersections 10 seconds after the light changed lol