F... Leaf Springs !!!!!!! uuurrrrgggg

sarge · 03-14-2012, 03:48 PM

OK had a blast over the week end , wheeled Sat. and broke a drive shaft u joint .... no biggy , fixed it and wheeled all day Sunday with out too much problems then last night a few guy when out and I decided to go....... I bent a leaf on the passenger side a few months ago and have been keeping an eye on it ever since , so ....... the drivers side main leaf snaps last night causing the front axle to rest on the bump stop all the way home and the passenger side spring looks like a figure 8 ....... Time for a change, time for links ....

I need some advise, 3 link ? 4 link ? radius arm ? I was thinking about copying the RC long arm Cherokee lift that we put on a buddies XJ ..... Any input would be great .....

Signed,

poor leaning jeep

mckeddie · 03-14-2012, 04:06 PM

Front or rear? Plans on street driving it? For street use, I would 3 link the front, double triangulate the rear. All trail, I would double triangulate both.

Drivermod · 03-14-2012, 04:11 PM

I agree with Mckeddie. If you still have a steering box I would go with a 3 link plus a trac bar. With a triangulated 4 link and no trac bar you will have bump steer.

carwash · 03-14-2012, 04:12 PM

What makes the 3 link more streetable in the front to you? I don't see any reason at all not to double triangulate both if you have the room, whether its street driven or not.

Let me know if you need link material sarge, I've got quite a few sizes in stock.

T-bird · 03-14-2012, 04:19 PM

With your fab skills you should skip right over a RC design. They are made to be bolt on suspensions and you can improve off their design by not being limited to where you can bolt brackets.

3 link with Panhard bar is what I would build, but I don't have an experience with a double trianguled front.

yellowjacket · 03-14-2012, 04:22 PM

as far as it leaning goes.....just rebuild your roll cage to be higher on the side that is lower.

and when u park just flex it up on something so it looks level:)

Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk

humpy · 03-14-2012, 10:57 PM

Screw a 3 link with teac bar... No way I woukd ever run that... Double triangulate both ends and wheel the piss out of it... Look at jwends fir good design

sarge · 03-14-2012, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yellowjacket

as far as it leaning goes.....just rebuild your roll cage to be higher on the side that is lower.

and when u park just flex it up on something so it looks level:)

Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk

did that tornado hit hit your head .....

hahahaha

sarge · 03-14-2012, 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carwash

What makes the 3 link more streetable in the front to you? I don't see any reason at all not to double triangulate both if you have the room, whether its street driven or not.

Let me know if you need link material sarge, I've got quite a few sizes in stock.

Street driven is not in the picture .... I live 1/2 mile from the woods and trailer my **** any further then that ... I want flexaable , low and capable . period . Mike , I will be getting with you soon , I have 200 feet of 1 3/4 " DOM hanging in the shop but not all of it is for me , I think I need to order some Ruffstuff hiems ....... more tomorrow

sarge · 03-14-2012, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mckeddie

Front or rear? Plans on street driving it? For street use, I would 3 link the front, double triangulate the rear. All trail, I would double triangulate both.

Front ! and limited steet use .... I am the law you know !!!!!

kentuckytwostep · 03-15-2012, 12:25 PM

If you're going to spend the time and money, no way should you radius arm it. I've got a 3 link + track bar in the front and 4 link in the rear and I like the way it works. For my layout 4 link wasn't possible in the front.

tjrider · 03-15-2012, 12:38 PM

I'm actually a fan of the radius long arm. I've heard seen a lot of good thing about them. And of course some hate mail...... I'm looking to do that to the tj

carwash · 03-15-2012, 01:18 PM

What could possibly by the good things about a radius arm assembly, aside from road handling? Desert trucks, maybe, cuz the axle drops evenly as it jumps etc. But on an offroad vehicle that needs to flex one tire down and one up, it's just plain awful. Relying on poly/rubber bushings to give and move inside an assembly to provide flex is crazy.

tjrider · 03-15-2012, 05:37 PM

Isn't that the purpose of the frame side heim joint? I'm not sure about a 3 link making 1 arm do the job of 2.(Upper 3rd link)

boomhauer · 03-15-2012, 08:11 PM

ain't nothing wrong with a 3 link front humpy. i love mine and it handles very well at speed on the road even with full hydro. the very same hour it was finished and running casey and i went for about and hour and a half long ride starting out on his windy ass curvy road and at 55 or 60 it handled great and still does 2 yrs. later.

as for flex, i usually win at our show and shines until dearing got his buggy done and if i remember correctly he was the only to better me last year at the c.o.r.e event. even beat brody's buggie. not that an rti ramp will do you any good in the woods.

Drivermod · 03-15-2012, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjrider

Isn't that the purpose of the frame side heim joint? I'm not sure about a 3 link making 1 arm do the job of 2.(Upper 3rd link)

My brother built his own radius arm setup on his Cherokee and it did not work well. He ended up removing one of the upper arms to get it to articulate better. It's awesome in the Dunes up in Michigan where he lives but doesn't work so well on the type of trails we run down here. The front end also tends to lift when climbing which is not helpful. It's not horrible but not my first or even second choice.

My suggestion for a 3 link was because if you have a drag link, when the suspension is cycled the drag link articulates thorugh and arc pushing and pulling on the steering knuckle which would cause some bump steer. If driving on the street, I would want to avoid that. By using a trac bar set up in the same plane as the drag link, the axle is forced side to side when articulating keeping the drag link from pushing or pulling on the knuckle. Since this is an offroad only vehicle, or if one was running full hydraulic steering, I'd go double triangulated 4 link if possible.

tjrider · 03-15-2012, 10:49 PM

So can you build a 3 link with factory link mounts? Or is it a custom application? I mean axle side

kentuckytwostep · 03-15-2012, 10:52 PM

tjrider
To understand how the radius arm fails, grab a broom stick with both hands and hold it out infront of you with your elbows at your side bent at a 90 degree angle. now grip the stick real hard and lower one hand (yes, I just said that) and raise the other as if the stick is the axle and your arms are the radius arms. Feel how the broom stick wants to twist in one hand or the other? that is what the axle housing is feeling when radius arms articulate. So you'll either break welds where the axle tubes are pressed into the chunk (what my old XJ did) or it will just bind up and not articulate very well. And what I hated most about radius arms is thier tendency to lift when you accelerate, which is not good when you are climbing a steep ledge/hill.

If you're worried about the single upper do like I did. design your lowers centered with the axle so they take all head on impacts. Then all the upper is doing is preventing the axle from spinning under acceleration or braking. This means that durring forward motion the upper is under compression = no problem :).

Depends on what you want to do. desert race (4link, radius arm) or rock krawl (3link, 4link) or run mud pits (whophucken cares).

tjrider · 03-15-2012, 11:15 PM

So are we building our own 3 link set up or buying a kit?

03-14-2012, 03:48 PM	#1
sarge Pure Bacon Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Trenton, Oh Posts: 1,098	F... Leaf Springs !!!!!!! uuurrrrgggg OK had a blast over the week end , wheeled Sat. and broke a drive shaft u joint .... no biggy , fixed it and wheeled all day Sunday with out too much problems then last night a few guy when out and I decided to go....... I bent a leaf on the passenger side a few months ago and have been keeping an eye on it ever since , so ....... the drivers side main leaf snaps last night causing the front axle to rest on the bump stop all the way home and the passenger side spring looks like a figure 8 ....... Time for a change, time for links .... I need some advise, 3 link ? 4 link ? radius arm ? I was thinking about copying the RC long arm Cherokee lift that we put on a buddies XJ ..... Any input would be great ..... Signed, poor leaning jeep

03-14-2012, 04:06 PM	#2
mckeddie Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: van wert oh Posts: 583	Front or rear? Plans on street driving it? For street use, I would 3 link the front, double triangulate the rear. All trail, I would double triangulate both. __________________ zuk buggy.....it'll be a jeep eventually.

03-14-2012, 04:11 PM	#3
Drivermod Join Date: May 2009 Location: Union, KY Posts: 225	I agree with Mckeddie. If you still have a steering box I would go with a 3 link plus a trac bar. With a triangulated 4 link and no trac bar you will have bump steer. __________________ Ian 06 Toyota 4Runner

03-14-2012, 04:12 PM	#4
carwash pimpin' IS easy Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Union, KY Posts: 3,344 Images: 605	What makes the 3 link more streetable in the front to you? I don't see any reason at all not to double triangulate both if you have the room, whether its street driven or not. Let me know if you need link material sarge, I've got quite a few sizes in stock. __________________

03-14-2012, 04:22 PM	#6
yellowjacket barely breathing Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: alexandria, ky Posts: 889	as far as it leaning goes.....just rebuild your roll cage to be higher on the side that is lower. and when u park just flex it up on something so it looks level:) Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk __________________ my next rig will be on the trail before zuk 2.0 will

03-14-2012, 04:19 PM	#5
T-bird Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Centerville Posts: 123	With your fab skills you should skip right over a RC design. They are made to be bolt on suspensions and you can improve off their design by not being limited to where you can bolt brackets. 3 link with Panhard bar is what I would build, but I don't have an experience with a double trianguled front.

03-14-2012, 10:57 PM	#7
humpy Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 573	Screw a 3 link with teac bar... No way I woukd ever run that... Double triangulate both ends and wheel the piss out of it... Look at jwends fir good design __________________ S10 with a few air shocks..

03-15-2012, 12:25 PM	#11
kentuckytwostep corsets make it tighter Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Berea, KY Posts: 185	If you're going to spend the time and money, no way should you radius arm it. I've got a 3 link + track bar in the front and 4 link in the rear and I like the way it works. For my layout 4 link wasn't possible in the front. __________________ ------------------------------------ my rig

03-15-2012, 12:38 PM	#12
tjrider Join Date: May 2009 Location: fairfield Posts: 320	I'm actually a fan of the radius long arm. I've heard seen a lot of good thing about them. And of course some hate mail...... I'm looking to do that to the tj __________________ If you don't want it broke, don't let me drive it....

03-15-2012, 01:18 PM	#13
carwash pimpin' IS easy Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Union, KY Posts: 3,344 Images: 605	What could possibly by the good things about a radius arm assembly, aside from road handling? Desert trucks, maybe, cuz the axle drops evenly as it jumps etc. But on an offroad vehicle that needs to flex one tire down and one up, it's just plain awful. Relying on poly/rubber bushings to give and move inside an assembly to provide flex is crazy. __________________

03-15-2012, 05:37 PM	#14
tjrider Join Date: May 2009 Location: fairfield Posts: 320	Isn't that the purpose of the frame side heim joint? I'm not sure about a 3 link making 1 arm do the job of 2.(Upper 3rd link) __________________ If you don't want it broke, don't let me drive it....

03-15-2012, 08:11 PM	#15
boomhauer Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 188	ain't nothing wrong with a 3 link front humpy. i love mine and it handles very well at speed on the road even with full hydro. the very same hour it was finished and running casey and i went for about and hour and a half long ride starting out on his windy ass curvy road and at 55 or 60 it handled great and still does 2 yrs. later. as for flex, i usually win at our show and shines until dearing got his buggy done and if i remember correctly he was the only to better me last year at the c.o.r.e event. even beat brody's buggie. not that an rti ramp will do you any good in the woods. __________________ 95 yj, fresh fuel injected 302, c-6, twin sticked 205, 3 linked high pinion d60 front, double trianulated 4 linked 14 bolt rear (all aluminum links) locked both ends, 4:56 gears, full hydro steering, high steer, 4 wheel discs, 16" 2.5 fox air shocks, 39.5" irok's. just finishing a full frame-up redo thanks to a great friend and one knowledgable(sp?) s.o.b casey cravens for without him this could not have been done in such a short time and done right! LOOK OUT "WHITEY" HERE I COME!!!

03-15-2012, 10:49 PM	#17
tjrider Join Date: May 2009 Location: fairfield Posts: 320	So can you build a 3 link with factory link mounts? Or is it a custom application? I mean axle side __________________ If you don't want it broke, don't let me drive it....

03-15-2012, 10:52 PM	#18
kentuckytwostep corsets make it tighter Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Berea, KY Posts: 185	tjrider To understand how the radius arm fails, grab a broom stick with both hands and hold it out infront of you with your elbows at your side bent at a 90 degree angle. now grip the stick real hard and lower one hand (yes, I just said that) and raise the other as if the stick is the axle and your arms are the radius arms. Feel how the broom stick wants to twist in one hand or the other? that is what the axle housing is feeling when radius arms articulate. So you'll either break welds where the axle tubes are pressed into the chunk (what my old XJ did) or it will just bind up and not articulate very well. And what I hated most about radius arms is thier tendency to lift when you accelerate, which is not good when you are climbing a steep ledge/hill. If you're worried about the single upper do like I did. design your lowers centered with the axle so they take all head on impacts. Then all the upper is doing is preventing the axle from spinning under acceleration or braking. This means that durring forward motion the upper is under compression = no problem :). Depends on what you want to do. desert race (4link, radius arm) or rock krawl (3link, 4link) or run mud pits (whophucken cares). __________________ ------------------------------------ my rig Last edited by kentuckytwostep; 03-15-2012 at 11:40 PM.

03-15-2012, 11:15 PM	#19
tjrider Join Date: May 2009 Location: fairfield Posts: 320	So are we building our own 3 link set up or buying a kit? __________________ If you don't want it broke, don't let me drive it....