Touch of bad luck on Saturday!!!!!!

77goldeneagle · 12-08-2008, 10:50 PM

Not all stories have a happy ending...............the ONLY good thing out of this is that my wife and I were unhurt and gratefull for having the excursion!!!

We have since been searching for a replacement!!

All told we rolled it twice................

By twisted84toyota at 2008-12-08

77goldeneagle · 12-08-2008, 10:53 PM

By twisted84toyota at 2008-12-08

bc35339 · 12-08-2008, 10:54 PM

Looks like you had someone looking over you!!! Glad to hear everyone one is ok..

77goldeneagle · 12-08-2008, 11:03 PM

we hit a patch of "black ice" at about 40-45..............and the rest is what you see!!

94Dodge Truggy · 12-09-2008, 07:44 AM

many people got taken out by the road conditions over the weekend!

mckeddie · 12-09-2008, 08:24 AM

OUCH! where'd that happen? looking for another excursion? i'll keep an eye out for one. haven't seen any for sale lately though in town, although my old one may be able to be purchased (identical to yours i think, and i REALLY want it back).

greg

fabricator · 12-09-2008, 10:03 AM

Cain't ya just buff that one out?

Hope Springs Hauler · 12-09-2008, 10:13 AM

since we have established that you are OK, it sucks that you will be slapped with "too fast for conditions" and "failure to control." :mad:
I swear, the cops (sorry sarge, etc:o ) and the law behind them just don't understand the term "accident."

tjjeepjeep · 12-09-2008, 10:31 AM

Glad to hear everyone is ok..

maddhatter · 12-09-2008, 02:22 PM

Looks pretty bad glad every one was ok!

wilson1010 · 12-09-2008, 03:21 PM

I'd say that Excursion held together pretty well. I'd get another one. As for the ticket, depending on the jurisdiction, I'd defend it. Everyone knows about "black ice." The cops rule that somebody has to get a ticket is just BS. (no offense sarge).

itbrokeagain · 12-10-2008, 12:13 AM

Good to hear you are ok. That being said, wheel it. If it was mine I would pound the roof out enough to get a windshield in and keep driving it. I aint all there though so my advice might not be the best.

77goldeneagle · 12-10-2008, 12:43 AM

well you all guessed correct I was cited for "Falure to control" .............we had JUST turned off of a side road and traveled about 150-200 yards down the road about a mile and a half SOUTH of Koosuth on ST RT 66 .........then all hell broke loose.........one thing I never mentioned before is that I was hauling a utility trailer with a crotch rocket on it I had sold to a guy in KY and was going to deliver it that Sunday............now for the unbelievable the bike NEVER left the trailer and the trailer never rolled there was 2 wraps in the safety chains the reciever and tongue of the trailer are all twisted

already located a 2003 X with a 7.3 PSD 4x4 and all the goodies......got the credit union pushing the papers through on that!!

By twisted84toyota at 2008-12-09

cheapthrills49 · 12-15-2008, 06:02 PM

so does that mean u have a set of Dana 60's 4 sale!!!!!!! lol

fabricator · 12-15-2008, 06:21 PM

is probably a 50/10.25

77goldeneagle · 12-15-2008, 07:26 PM

its got a 60/10.25 all 4:30 to 1 ratio fronts were 60's which is what I had............the whole truck is for sale at the auction GREAT running V-10

sarge · 12-15-2008, 07:34 PM

no offense taken , there are far more A**hole cops out there then understanding ones .
But lets clarify something .

In Ohio there is no such thing as an accident ! it's a traffic crash.

You were going to fast for the conditions , therefore you crashed = no accident .
Your defense can't be -- you accidently were going to fast for the conditions . well you could say that ....but you would look kinda stupid in court.
You can't accidently fall asleep , drink too much , fail to fix that bad tie rod end, or drive like an idiot.

You can blame your insurance company for your ticket ! They insist that we ( the police ) fully investigate the crash which takes a few hours to do correctly for just a simple crash. They charge you your deductable they sue the other guy or the tire company , they want us to testify in court ...... and the list goes on at the expense of the City. The only way a city can get just a little bit of that back is to cite you for the time you have used in the form of a FTC citation.

That being said ... your ticket was BS , however , I don't know the area that you were in , but all police departments have different internal policies as to citations after a crash.
My policy is complete Officer discretion , unless the at fault driver is a juvenile or the at fault driver doesn't show his or her insurance card.

fabricator · 12-15-2008, 08:59 PM

ok, makes cents.....lol
couple -o- questions....

so, if i was in a 6 car crash.
how do you determine who's at fault?

tinbeater rolled back into me at the bridge,
scratched me bumper, wrinkled his sheetmetal

was i following too close or was he drinking to much?

sarge · 12-15-2008, 10:11 PM

hhmmm Never had a 6 car pile up ( CHIPS style ). But never had a smaller one that we could not find the one that started the whole thing.

I think the whole Bridge thing had some GAY over tones !!!!

boomhauer · 12-15-2008, 11:19 PM

what auction are you referring to please. may be interested in it. and just out of curiosity, are you sure it is a 10.25 and not a 10.50? just went through finding out what my "new" excursion had under it and found them to be a 50 front and 10.50 rear. guess it all depends on the year though. mine is a 2000

b.t.w. how many miles are on it and when is this auction?

4RunnerAdam · 12-15-2008, 11:31 PM

Glad you are alright.

I'm curious. You say your gratefull for having the excursion. I understand what your saying, but I wonder, would you have been in this situation at all if you had a normal passenger car? Maybe the excursion got you in the situation. Luckily it held together to protect you.

77goldeneagle · 12-16-2008, 11:34 AM

the "crash" as it were happened a meer 150-200 yards off of a side road I had just turned off of...the highway patrol had said that a mile in either direction the road was clear but this particular 1/4 mile or so streach was nothing but a sheet of ice.........as far as the X getting me into the situation I can't see how......the roads were not bad that warrented 4WD. I was not traveling what I had believed to be TO FAST just pulling off of a side road hauling a trailer going to get my kids...........was in no hurry or anything like that............besides 4WD has its limitations on ice as does everything my dad drives M1A2 ABRAMS TANKS and they really suck on the snow and ice according to him

and when it went around it was INSTANT there was no time to try to save it I'd concider myself to be a pretty decient driver and there was NO WAY I could have not had the crash

BOOMHAUER: its gonna be an insurance auction STATE FARM has the X it had a V-10 60/10.25 4:30's and 130K

SARGE: I am near Lima at least the SMALL out crops of Spencerville

wilson1010 · 12-16-2008, 02:08 PM

The myth that smaller, more "agile" cars are safer is just that - a myth. Drivers in large cars are much less likely to have an accident where there are injuries, period. And when there is a serious accident, drivers in small cars are a whole lot more likely to be ejected and/or killed. The NTSB has enough stats on this subject to scare the hell out of anyone, but because of the environmentalist movement for better fuel consumption there is not much publicity regarding the dangers of small cars. I've had three friends killed in car crashes and I don't have all that many friends to begin with. :)

As for the police riddle about "too fast for conditions," it goes like this: if there is a collision, that means that someone did something wrong. Its the classic "Catch 22" logical fallacy. Because there was a collision someone must be at fault, you were the only driver, therefore it was you.

I think courts are sympathetic to the "black ice" situation since the point of black ice is that it is not apparent from visual observation.

I'd plead not guilty and go to court and tell the judge that it was black ice and see what he says. The cop didn't see the accident and there won't be any witnesses other than you and the cop. Of course, there is the possibility (no offense sarge) that the cop will lie, which they do more frequently than you might think, and say that there were icy conditions that he observed at the scene that you should have been aware of. But, nothing ventured, nothing gained.

4RunnerAdam · 12-16-2008, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 77goldeneagle

as far as the X getting me into the situation I can't see how......

What I was thinking, was if you were in a small passenger car, you would not have rolled. Maybe just slid off the road and got stuck.

I'm guessing you slid on the ice, and then went off the road, the truck got grip, and it rolled. The high center of gravity may have caused the truck to roll, where a small car with a lower COG probably wouldnt have rolled.

Don't get me wrong, I drive an SUV myself and firmly beleive I am safer in it.

blazerbrad · 12-16-2008, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4RunnerAdam

What I was thinking, was if you were in a small passenger car, you would not have rolled. Maybe just slid off the road and got stuck.

I'm guessing you slid on the ice, and then went off the road, the truck got grip, and it rolled. The high center of gravity may have caused the truck to roll, where a small car with a lower COG probably wouldnt have rolled.

Don't get me wrong, I drive an SUV myself and firmly beleive I am safer in it.

I do automotive testing for a living, including quite a few dynamic handling tests, so I just have to chime in.

What is said above is quite possible, though it's really hard to say for sure because of all of the variables involved. Obviously the X is bigger and has a higher CG and is more prone to rollover, and with the larger momentum will continue to roll longer once it starts.

Most "cars" are much less likely to roll but all bets are off when you get into a "tripped" situation (sliding sideways and hit a curb, for example).

Most cars generally have better handling characteristics and would likely of not spun out quite as easy (large mass, high CG = more likely to loose control)...but again not saying a car would of definitely not loss control in the same situation.

For safey, the one comment I do have to address is about being more likely to get ejected from a smaller vehicle. Okay, but only if you don't have your seatbelt on which makes it all a moot point....sorry to offend anyone, but anybody who does not wear their seatbelt is just stupid. We do crash demonstrations all of the time of belted vs. unbelted occupants in the car and you go from basically zero injuries for someone with a seatbelt on to serious injuries or death for somebody without a seatbelt on in the exact same situation. I'm not talking about 100 mph multiple roll-overs, I'm talking about even rather minor accidents.

12-08-2008, 10:50 PM	#1
77goldeneagle Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Spencerville,OH Posts: 74	Touch of bad luck on Saturday!!!!!! Not all stories have a happy ending...............the ONLY good thing out of this is that my wife and I were unhurt and gratefull for having the excursion!!! We have since been searching for a replacement!! All told we rolled it twice................ By twisted84toyota at 2008-12-08 By twisted84toyota at 2008-12-08 By twisted84toyota at 2008-12-08 By twisted84toyota at 2008-12-08

12-09-2008, 07:44 AM	#5
94Dodge Truggy EX-Vice President Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Fairfield, Ohio Posts: 3,048	many people got taken out by the road conditions over the weekend! __________________

12-09-2008, 08:24 AM	#6
mckeddie Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: van wert oh Posts: 583	OUCH! where'd that happen? looking for another excursion? i'll keep an eye out for one. haven't seen any for sale lately though in town, although my old one may be able to be purchased (identical to yours i think, and i REALLY want it back). greg __________________ zuk buggy.....it'll be a jeep eventually.

12-09-2008, 10:03 AM	#7
fabricator Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Cincy, Oh Posts: 947	Cain't ya just buff that one out? __________________ For you guys who can't drive, I have owned a frame rack for several years. Prices are based on your skill and ability to wreck it....

12-09-2008, 10:13 AM	#8
Hope Springs Hauler Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Hamilton, OH Posts: 431 Images: 16	since we have established that you are OK, it sucks that you will be slapped with "too fast for conditions" and "failure to control." :mad: I swear, the cops (sorry sarge, etc:o ) and the law behind them just don't understand the term "accident." __________________ 1988 Suzuki Samurai on propane FJ 40 axles (4.10) 5.14 tcase 36" TSL SX

12-08-2008, 10:53 PM	#2
77goldeneagle Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Spencerville,OH Posts: 74	By twisted84toyota at 2008-12-08

12-08-2008, 10:54 PM	#3
bc35339 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Mount Washington KY Posts: 133	Looks like you had someone looking over you!!! Glad to hear everyone one is ok..

12-08-2008, 11:03 PM	#4
77goldeneagle Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Spencerville,OH Posts: 74	we hit a patch of "black ice" at about 40-45..............and the rest is what you see!!

12-09-2008, 10:31 AM	#9
tjjeepjeep Just tired Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hamilton, OH Posts: 2,213 Images: 2212	Glad to hear everyone is ok.. __________________ I want to be the reason you look down at your phone and smile........then walk into a pole.

12-09-2008, 02:22 PM	#10
maddhatter Join Date: May 2007 Location: loveland OH Posts: 324	Looks pretty bad glad every one was ok!

12-09-2008, 03:21 PM	#11
wilson1010 Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 147	I'd say that Excursion held together pretty well. I'd get another one. As for the ticket, depending on the jurisdiction, I'd defend it. Everyone knows about "black ice." The cops rule that somebody has to get a ticket is just BS. (no offense sarge). __________________ Unimog 406 XJ with a bunch of stuff put on by somebody else

12-10-2008, 12:13 AM	#12
itbrokeagain Just Empty Every Pocket - CORE Member - Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Amelia Posts: 1,435	Good to hear you are ok. That being said, wheel it. If it was mine I would pound the roof out enough to get a windshield in and keep driving it. I aint all there though so my advice might not be the best. __________________ 91 fj 80 on 37 Nitto Muds with a 10k winch. Cage and sliders coming soon.

12-10-2008, 12:43 AM	#13
77goldeneagle Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Spencerville,OH Posts: 74	well you all guessed correct I was cited for "Falure to control" .............we had JUST turned off of a side road and traveled about 150-200 yards down the road about a mile and a half SOUTH of Koosuth on ST RT 66 .........then all hell broke loose.........one thing I never mentioned before is that I was hauling a utility trailer with a crotch rocket on it I had sold to a guy in KY and was going to deliver it that Sunday............now for the unbelievable the bike NEVER left the trailer and the trailer never rolled there was 2 wraps in the safety chains the reciever and tongue of the trailer are all twisted already located a 2003 X with a 7.3 PSD 4x4 and all the goodies......got the credit union pushing the papers through on that!! By twisted84toyota at 2008-12-09 By twisted84toyota at 2008-12-09 By twisted84toyota at 2008-12-09

12-15-2008, 06:02 PM	#14
cheapthrills49 VANILLA GORILLA Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: blanmolester, ohio.......stonelick lake Posts: 192	so does that mean u have a set of Dana 60's 4 sale!!!!!!! lol

12-15-2008, 06:21 PM	#15
fabricator Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Cincy, Oh Posts: 947	is probably a 50/10.25 __________________ For you guys who can't drive, I have owned a frame rack for several years. Prices are based on your skill and ability to wreck it....

12-15-2008, 07:26 PM	#16
77goldeneagle Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Spencerville,OH Posts: 74	its got a 60/10.25 all 4:30 to 1 ratio fronts were 60's which is what I had............the whole truck is for sale at the auction GREAT running V-10

12-15-2008, 07:34 PM	#17
sarge Pure Bacon Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Trenton, Oh Posts: 1,098	no offense taken , there are far more A**hole cops out there then understanding ones . But lets clarify something . In Ohio there is no such thing as an accident ! it's a traffic crash. You were going to fast for the conditions , therefore you crashed = no accident . Your defense can't be -- you accidently were going to fast for the conditions . well you could say that ....but you would look kinda stupid in court. You can't accidently fall asleep , drink too much , fail to fix that bad tie rod end, or drive like an idiot. You can blame your insurance company for your ticket ! They insist that we ( the police ) fully investigate the crash which takes a few hours to do correctly for just a simple crash. They charge you your deductable they sue the other guy or the tire company , they want us to testify in court ...... and the list goes on at the expense of the City. The only way a city can get just a little bit of that back is to cite you for the time you have used in the form of a FTC citation. That being said ... your ticket was BS , however , I don't know the area that you were in , but all police departments have different internal policies as to citations after a crash. My policy is complete Officer discretion , unless the at fault driver is a juvenile or the at fault driver doesn't show his or her insurance card.

12-15-2008, 08:59 PM	#18
fabricator Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Cincy, Oh Posts: 947	ok, makes cents.....lol couple -o- questions.... so, if i was in a 6 car crash. how do you determine who's at fault? tinbeater rolled back into me at the bridge, scratched me bumper, wrinkled his sheetmetal was i following too close or was he drinking to much? __________________ For you guys who can't drive, I have owned a frame rack for several years. Prices are based on your skill and ability to wreck it....

12-15-2008, 10:11 PM	#19
sarge Pure Bacon Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Trenton, Oh Posts: 1,098	hhmmm Never had a 6 car pile up ( CHIPS style ). But never had a smaller one that we could not find the one that started the whole thing. I think the whole Bridge thing had some GAY over tones !!!!

12-15-2008, 11:19 PM	#20
boomhauer Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 188	what auction are you referring to please. may be interested in it. and just out of curiosity, are you sure it is a 10.25 and not a 10.50? just went through finding out what my "new" excursion had under it and found them to be a 50 front and 10.50 rear. guess it all depends on the year though. mine is a 2000 b.t.w. how many miles are on it and when is this auction? __________________ 95 yj, fresh fuel injected 302, c-6, twin sticked 205, 3 linked high pinion d60 front, double trianulated 4 linked 14 bolt rear (all aluminum links) locked both ends, 4:56 gears, full hydro steering, high steer, 4 wheel discs, 16" 2.5 fox air shocks, 39.5" irok's. just finishing a full frame-up redo thanks to a great friend and one knowledgable(sp?) s.o.b casey cravens for without him this could not have been done in such a short time and done right! LOOK OUT "WHITEY" HERE I COME!!!

12-15-2008, 11:31 PM	#21
4RunnerAdam Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: near eastgate mall Posts: 171	Glad you are alright. I'm curious. You say your gratefull for having the excursion. I understand what your saying, but I wonder, would you have been in this situation at all if you had a normal passenger car? Maybe the excursion got you in the situation. Luckily it held together to protect you. __________________ 88 4Runner, 350 V8 swap in progress http://staff.4x4wire.com/adamf

12-16-2008, 11:34 AM	#22
77goldeneagle Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Spencerville,OH Posts: 74	the "crash" as it were happened a meer 150-200 yards off of a side road I had just turned off of...the highway patrol had said that a mile in either direction the road was clear but this particular 1/4 mile or so streach was nothing but a sheet of ice.........as far as the X getting me into the situation I can't see how......the roads were not bad that warrented 4WD. I was not traveling what I had believed to be TO FAST just pulling off of a side road hauling a trailer going to get my kids...........was in no hurry or anything like that............besides 4WD has its limitations on ice as does everything my dad drives M1A2 ABRAMS TANKS and they really suck on the snow and ice according to him and when it went around it was INSTANT there was no time to try to save it I'd concider myself to be a pretty decient driver and there was NO WAY I could have not had the crash BOOMHAUER: its gonna be an insurance auction STATE FARM has the X it had a V-10 60/10.25 4:30's and 130K SARGE: I am near Lima at least the SMALL out crops of Spencerville

12-16-2008, 02:08 PM	#23
wilson1010 Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 147	The myth that smaller, more "agile" cars are safer is just that - a myth. Drivers in large cars are much less likely to have an accident where there are injuries, period. And when there is a serious accident, drivers in small cars are a whole lot more likely to be ejected and/or killed. The NTSB has enough stats on this subject to scare the hell out of anyone, but because of the environmentalist movement for better fuel consumption there is not much publicity regarding the dangers of small cars. I've had three friends killed in car crashes and I don't have all that many friends to begin with. :) As for the police riddle about "too fast for conditions," it goes like this: if there is a collision, that means that someone did something wrong. Its the classic "Catch 22" logical fallacy. Because there was a collision someone must be at fault, you were the only driver, therefore it was you. I think courts are sympathetic to the "black ice" situation since the point of black ice is that it is not apparent from visual observation. I'd plead not guilty and go to court and tell the judge that it was black ice and see what he says. The cop didn't see the accident and there won't be any witnesses other than you and the cop. Of course, there is the possibility (no offense sarge) that the cop will lie, which they do more frequently than you might think, and say that there were icy conditions that he observed at the scene that you should have been aware of. But, nothing ventured, nothing gained. __________________ Unimog 406 XJ with a bunch of stuff put on by somebody else